Blowback pistols

october · Post by **october** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 6:02 am

i have both airsoft and a blank firing gun. i would rather use the airsoft guns as they dont make hardly any noise, and are cheaper to operate. the blanks are expensive and are really loud. plus you dont get a muzzle flash anyway. the only real advantage is that the spent casings are ejected (which happens so fast you can barely see it). i can fire an airsoft gun all day in my kitchen and not worry about ear plugs, noise, or buying blanks. also i dont mind opening up a cheap airsoft gun to make modifications, etc. also the gas airsoft guns on dropshipsports.com DO NOT have blowback action. anyway, my 2 cents...

El Brenty · Post by **El Brenty** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 10:05 am

Lots of movies don't even fire guns! The shots are added in post production. For guns like automatics, they shake the gun to give the appearance of the firing action.

Carnage7p · Post by **Carnage7p** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:24 pm

yeah the bad thing about that though, at least for me, is most of my actors are amateur at best and their shaking of the gun looks more like they are having a seizure. but luckily i just met a kid from the theater department who is really into film and we might work on a movie together and he knows all the actors and actresses at my college.

Raptor · Post by **Raptor** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 10:06 pm

I3lade203 wrote:Blank guns don't shoot anything, thats why it's a blank.

WRONG! Blanks have a plug, they do not shoot a projectile, but are technically a firearm and can cause serious injury or death. That is why any motion picture using blanks requires an armorer on set, witht he weapons at all times. Blanks are not toys, and should not be treated as such, they are a weapon like any other and should be handled with the same respect. It's attitudes like this where people don't know what they ar ereally handling that result in stricter laws governing blank/replica weapons.

bad_karma24 · Post by **bad_karma24** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 10:30 pm

WRONG! Blanks have a plug, they do not shoot a projectile, but are technically a firearm and can cause serious injury or death. That is why any motion picture using blanks requires an armorer on set, witht he weapons at all times. Blanks are not toys, and should not be treated as such, they are a weapon like any other and should be handled with the same respect. It's attitudes like this where people don't know what they ar ereally handling that result in stricter laws governing blank/replica weapons.

Thank you.

Blanks are very dangerous. At reenactments we issue extreme cautions before any battles begin, because in the past people have been injured with blank rounds. One guy actually mixed in live rounds with blanks, and almost killed some people.

slimdog55 · Post by **slimdog55** » Wed Sep 29, 2004 11:16 pm

Everybody says Brandon Lee died from blanks, well actually, the armoror wasn't on the set, (Out of town) So someone went to a store and bought live ammunition instead of blank rounds for the gun. What someboady did was just take the bullet projectile off and then put it in the gun. But a couple of days earlier from that day, someone did the same with live ammo, took out the bullet, took out the black powder, and forgot to take the primer out. When the round was fired, something got stuck in the barrel. Then when they filmed another scene, (Someone was lazy and didn't clean out the barrel), he shot the round, and whatever was in the barrel hit Brandon Lee in the chest. Hours later, he died. I Think thats what happended. Correct me if I'm wrong. I know blanks are very dangerous, but the effect on film is good. Everybody could be safe when using blank firing guns if they take some type of firearms training course.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:30 am

Yeah yeah yeah... speculation conspiracy... somebody just wanted him dead! Not to mention, nowadays blank-firing weapons cannot fire live ammunition unless you've replaced the chamber with an able one.

Blanks are still dangerous, people!

abodeofthedamned · Post by **abodeofthedamned** » Thu Sep 30, 2004 8:26 pm

slimdog55 wrote:Everybody says Brandon Lee died from blanks, well actually, the armoror wasn't on the set, (Out of town) So someone went to a store and bought live ammunition instead of blank rounds for the gun. What someboady did was just take the bullet projectile off and then put it in the gun. But a couple of days earlier from that day, someone did the same with live ammo, took out the bullet, took out the black powder, and forgot to take the primer out. When the round was fired, something got stuck in the barrel. Then when they filmed another scene, (Someone was lazy and didn't clean out the barrel), he shot the round, and whatever was in the barrel hit Brandon Lee in the chest. Hours later, he died. I Think thats what happended. Correct me if I'm wrong. I know blanks are very dangerous, but the effect on film is good. Everybody could be safe when using blank firing guns if they take some type of firearms training course.

You've got it mostly right. The crewman in question seated 6 bullet's back in their casings ( The gun was a revolver) after removing the powder, then inserted them into the cylinder for a scene looking down the barrel of the gun. They wanted to see the rounds in the cylinder.
After the scene was filmed some of the cast or crew were screwing around with the gun and pulled the trigger. The primer dislodged the bullet and it stuck in the barrel. The next day of filming the crew handling the guns didn't check the barrel before loading the blanks and handing it off to the actor. Then when it came time for him to fire...well you know the rest.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 9:32 pm

That's pretty well set up if you can believe it. There are many versions to that story. Though I do not doubt the fact that most crew members aren't that bright. Why they even used the same gun is unbelievable unless they were forced on budget. Lord knows why there were even live rounds on the set! Loaded blanks look quite real enough to the camera.

SgtPadrino · Post by **SgtPadrino** » Fri Oct 01, 2004 10:16 pm

The blank firing guns we're talking about here are exactly that. They are specifically designed for use in movies and on stage, and it is ensured by federal law that it is not possible to modify them to fire real projectiles. That's why it does not require any sort of licences and permits to own them. Both Raptor and bad karma are talking about using blank loads in real guns, which not a lot of people here have.

Towels42 · Post by **Towels42** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:06 am

Blank-firing guns are a bit too risky for me... and pretty inconvenient. Anyway, blank-firing weapons are not toys in the least -- even though they were used as such on the set of 'Bonanza.' The actors used to sneak up on other actors and shoot off a round underneath their chair and watch the victim jump eight feet in the air. That's not the sort of thing you should be doing, lol.

ALove · Post by **ALove** » Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:38 am

its hard to get a blank mg42 so ill stick with creating my props or airsoft

camiziodeltoro · Post by **camiziodeltoro** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 1:57 pm

hi,
it's true that there are some blank guns with a solid barrel that just show a big flash from the top(ejection port) it is however pssible to draw a muzzleflash in front of it later on. th advantage of these guns over the airsoft guns are that it has a realistic recoil and a shel ejecting.
However, i use a lot of blank firing guns, wich do not have solid barrels. they sell them in germanyto anyone over 18. There are also special blanks available wich show an extended flash, wich are extremely cool for film use, especially when emptying a 15 round clip within 2 seconds.
bad thing about blank firing guns is that they are extremely loud and indoors give so much power, that a digital camera may malfunction because of the pressurewave.
Therefor i have also some plug fire cartridge guns, wich are extremely realistic looking guns with reusable brass cartridges wich can be filled with smal firing plugs. they give a small bang, but look very realistic. they where used a lot in honk kong movies in the 80' s and 90' s...
Sometimes i also use airsoftguns, mostly in scenes where actors and crew are packed in a small room. it avoids accidents...

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm

ALove wrote:its hard to get a blank mg42 so ill stick with creating my props or airsoft

They aren't that hard to find if you know where to look. I've seen a few along with some listed M60s... if you are willing to pay around $6,000-14,000 for one, that is.

slimdog55 · Post by **slimdog55** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 9:34 pm

Hey camiziodeltoro, you did what exactly I was gonna do. I'm planning on importing a blank firing Bruni Glock 17 (9mm PAK) from Germany. (Again, it's gonna be b**ch getting it to clear customs.) The barrel is open so the flash is going to come out of the front. And you also did what I was going to do with the flash, get "Flash Defence Blanks" by Wadie.

Here's what the flash looks like.

I'd pick this over any airsoft gun anyday. camiziodeltoro, what kind of blank firing pistols do you have? Where did you purchese them? Do you live in the USA? (If so, how long did it take to clear customs?) Please send me a video of you shooting a blank firing gun with the special ammo. Send all the answers and video to abdullai@sbcglobal.net. Thanks.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Tue Oct 05, 2004 11:02 pm

That's a bit overkill. Pistols don't blast that much fire and junk. I wonder if the amount of powder is adjustable or if they are all the same manufactured. Impressive looking, nonetheless.

SgtPadrino · Post by **SgtPadrino** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 10:30 pm

Yeah that flash is WAY too big. But you really don't need to go to all the trouble of getting one from Germany - there's tons of places you could find right here in the US that sells them. Or just look around for some of the PFC guns, like deltoro was talking about.

slimdog55 · Post by **slimdog55** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 10:49 pm

Yeah, but the ones that are in the US have plugged barrels. The one made in Germany have the barrel open. (So flash comes out in front) PFC Guns are a bit expensive, caps are hard to find, and some of the models have plugged barrels. I'd still go for the blank firing guns.

I3lade203 · Post by **I3lade203** » Wed Oct 06, 2004 10:52 pm

Althougth big, impressive muzzle flash from a blank, I wouldn't expect less though.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 8:27 am

slimdog55 wrote:Yeah, but the ones that are in the US have plugged barrels. The one made in Germany have the barrel open. (So flash comes out in front) PFC Guns are a bit expensive, caps are hard to find, and some of the models have plugged barrels. I'd still go for the blank firing guns.

Many modern rifles have side flash suppression anyways, no complaints!

DaveP · Post by **DaveP** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:24 pm

lol, in england, only upward firing blank guns are properley legal, the forward firing ones are kinda grey area. also, forward firing ones can cause serious burns to actors, ect. (think about how hot something has to be to be white)

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 6:16 pm

The Saving Private Ryan crew had a heck of a time getting their dummy gun props into England for the film!

mercenary123 · Post by **mercenary123** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 1:01 am

I'd like to use blanks but here are some reasons why I don't...

1. Too expensive
2. Have no idea where I could use them without anoying someone
3. I bit too real, if too close it'll burn your face or somethin'

Also, Jason Lee (Bruce Lee's son) was killed by the wadding in a blank fire cartridge after the gun was fired (of course) because the gun didn't have a plug in it, though that won't happen now<<my 2 cents

NPMAX · Post by **NPMAX** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 2:16 pm

Also, Jason Lee (Bruce Lee's son) was killed by the wadding

Brandon Lee dude.

west1200 · Post by **west1200** » Sun Oct 31, 2004 11:46 am

haha what a coinsidence i just went by his grave the other day lol (still atleast 2 people there all the time

)

o ya and should you usethe metal airsoft guns or do the plastic ones look real on film? and do they have plastic ones that blow back?